You are not logged in.

#1 2015-10-30 05:18:31

jt
Member
From: Bermuda Triangle, NC USA
Registered: 2014-05-21
Posts: 1,376

Storage for G4 machines under OS9, SATA Card or SATA->IDE adapter?

I need to upgrade the mass storage in my G4 triplets. Is there a SATA card available for a reasonable amount of money for the main machine or am I better off just using a SATA->PATA adapter in all three of them?

DA/466
QS/Dual 1GHz
MDD'03/1.25GHz: OS9 Special Edition

I don't need anything that requires speed, just need to get back to playing in Illustrator and GraphicConverter.

Are there any big cheap (NIB) PATA drives left on the market?

Offline

#2 2015-10-30 12:50:17

TheWhiteFalcon
Member
Registered: 2015-04-27
Posts: 504

Re: Storage for G4 machines under OS9, SATA Card or SATA->IDE adapter?

Cheap large PATA drives, not that I'm aware of. Anything bigger than 80GB is pretty expensive now I believe.

Sonnet still wants $80 for a two port SATA card but I have to imagine resellers/eBay would have them cheaper than that.

Offline

#3 2015-10-30 13:17:44

jt
Member
From: Bermuda Triangle, NC USA
Registered: 2014-05-21
Posts: 1,376

Re: Storage for G4 machines under OS9, SATA Card or SATA->IDE adapter?

http://www.sonnettech.com/product/tempo_serial_ata.html

Thanks, that looks like it might be the ticket for my daily driver now that finances have become a tad more workable, but it will still have to wait a bit. I've already got Sonnet's Tempo™ Bridge adapter and it looks like generic adapters are cheap dirt from China already.

I can't believe I didn't think to look at Sonnet's product lineup. I LOVE their products. Curious to see Thunderbolt stuff on their Legacy Products page.

Does anyone here have practical experience with card vs. adapter under Native9?

Last edited by jt (2015-10-30 13:42:56)

Offline

#4 2015-10-30 17:16:39

cc333
Member
From: North S.F. Bay Area, CA
Registered: 2014-05-23
Posts: 562

Re: Storage for G4 machines under OS9, SATA Card or SATA->IDE adapter?

I've tried a card under OS 9, and it works fine.

I had OS 9 on a 30 GB SSD, and it was super speedy.

You can also use whatever other cheap SATA hard drive you want, but since the card is limited to SATA 1.5 (150Mbps?), it won't be as fast as a modern machine's bus might be, but it's still plenty fast compared to ATA6.

Still, if you can afford one, go get it! It's probably one of the best upgrades you could get, aside from a CPU upgrade.

I tried an SATA to PATA adapter as well, and while it worked, I couldn't get it to fit in the machine properly (I tried it in two machines, the first was a Quicksilver, but I can't remember what the other one was... it was probably my MDD), so I couldn't use it.

c


Main Macs: Early '09 Mac Pro, Mid '12 MacBook Pro 13"
Secondary Macs: Early '08 Mac Pro, Mid '12 MacBook Pro 15"
Playthings: Mac SE/30, 3.0 GHz Mavericks-based HackServe, Many others....
Desired: Lisa, Kanga PowerBook G3, Apple IIc, Apple II, Spare parts, etc.

Offline

#5 2015-10-30 19:14:50

ScutBoy
Member
Registered: 2014-05-25
Posts: 155

Re: Storage for G4 machines under OS9, SATA Card or SATA->IDE adapter?

JT - I think I've got a Sonnet SATA card stashed at home. I'll check and PM you if that is in fact true.

Offline

#6 2015-10-30 19:22:12

Eudimorphodon
Member
Registered: 2014-09-02
Posts: 522

Re: Storage for G4 machines under OS9, SATA Card or SATA->IDE adapter?

Once upon a time I knew a hardware engineer that was using SATA->PATA bridges in his reliability testing because he'd discovered they were a great way to generate spurious hard drive errors. But that was a long time ago, fairly shortly after SATA came out. Presumably they work well enough now.


Flap Different.

Offline

#7 2015-10-30 20:46:24

ScutBoy
Member
Registered: 2014-05-25
Posts: 155

Re: Storage for G4 machines under OS9, SATA Card or SATA->IDE adapter?

Eudi - was that a "bug" or a "feature"? smile

Offline

#8 2015-10-30 20:57:20

Eudimorphodon
Member
Registered: 2014-09-02
Posts: 522

Re: Storage for G4 machines under OS9, SATA Card or SATA->IDE adapter?

It was living proof that depending on your point of view anything can be either. wink


Flap Different.

Offline

#9 2015-10-30 21:54:55

jt
Member
From: Bermuda Triangle, NC USA
Registered: 2014-05-21
Posts: 1,376

Re: Storage for G4 machines under OS9, SATA Card or SATA->IDE adapter?

That's what she said.

Offline

#10 2015-10-31 06:29:29

LCGuy
Administrator
From: Sydney, Australia
Registered: 2014-05-13
Posts: 805

Re: Storage for G4 machines under OS9, SATA Card or SATA->IDE adapter?

I've been running a Sonnet Tempo SATA in my Beige G3 under 9.2.2 for a couple of years now. Solid as a rock. Sonnet's firmware presents the drives to the Mac as SCSI drives so there's no drivers to install or anything. Its just plug and play. I currently run a 500GB off mine, and have previously run a 750GB off it.

Offline

#11 2015-10-31 12:57:16

jt
Member
From: Bermuda Triangle, NC USA
Registered: 2014-05-21
Posts: 1,376

Re: Storage for G4 machines under OS9, SATA Card or SATA->IDE adapter?

Cool, glad to hear it. IIRC the Mac looks at all storage like it's SCSI. This reminds me of the threads about getting SCA Server Drives up and running in 68k NuBus Architecture era Macs. PCI and ATA seem a bit like NuBus and SCSI in terms of the hurdles of obsolescence in a PCIe world.

Offline

#12 2015-10-31 17:57:15

ClassicHasClass
Member
From: Electron Alley
Registered: 2014-05-26
Posts: 1,081
Website

Re: Storage for G4 machines under OS9, SATA Card or SATA->IDE adapter?

Yep, same thing (in an MDD). Worked fine in OS 9. No drivers needed, as LCGuy said.

Offline

#13 2015-11-01 18:40:25

cc333
Member
From: North S.F. Bay Area, CA
Registered: 2014-05-23
Posts: 562

Re: Storage for G4 machines under OS9, SATA Card or SATA->IDE adapter?

From what I can tell, the Mac *does* know the difference between SCSI and ATA?

c


Main Macs: Early '09 Mac Pro, Mid '12 MacBook Pro 13"
Secondary Macs: Early '08 Mac Pro, Mid '12 MacBook Pro 15"
Playthings: Mac SE/30, 3.0 GHz Mavericks-based HackServe, Many others....
Desired: Lisa, Kanga PowerBook G3, Apple IIc, Apple II, Spare parts, etc.

Offline

#14 2015-11-01 18:59:43

bbraun
Member
Registered: 2014-05-29
Posts: 1,064
Website

Re: Storage for G4 machines under OS9, SATA Card or SATA->IDE adapter?

Why must everything be so black and white?  Is there no room for anything in between?
SCSI and ATA command sets have grown together over the years, and from a logical perspective, it makes sense to have the software implementations grow together and share a lot of the same code.  Generally speaking, the software retained the "SCSI" name long after the majority of uses switched to ATA and machines stopped shipping with SCSI at all, largely because the command set has its roots in SCSI.  But that doesn't mean "everything is SCSI".

But ultimately, it doesn't really matter.  There's nothing even named 'SCSI' at the core of MacOS' disk interfaces.  There is a "drive" object, which has a driver that knows how to talk to it.

Offline

#15 2015-11-01 19:34:48

jt
Member
From: Bermuda Triangle, NC USA
Registered: 2014-05-21
Posts: 1,376

Re: Storage for G4 machines under OS9, SATA Card or SATA->IDE adapter?

Thanks, that explains a lot. The original HDDs just happened to be SCSI, mostly because there wasn't any room or power available inside a Compact for an internal until the SE shipped alongside the Macintosh II. SCSI was also the interface for Scanners, Linos and everything else in the wild and wonderful world of WYSIWYG DTP in that Mac-centric era of Graphic Design.

Offline

#16 2015-11-16 16:56:58

jt
Member
From: Bermuda Triangle, NC USA
Registered: 2014-05-21
Posts: 1,376

Re: Storage for G4 machines under OS9, SATA Card or SATA->IDE adapter?

THX, ScutBoy! Just ordered a Seagate LP ST31500541AS 1.5TB 32MB SATA drive for playtime next week. Not worried about speed, just backing up every Classic Mac HDD in the inventory to one disk. Strange to be copying drives with 12MB less storage capacity than just the freakin' cache of its 25 years newer HDD descendant. big_smile

Offline

Board footer

About ThinkClassic

ThinkClassic specialises in the maintenance, repair, restoration and modification of Vintage Apple and Macintosh computers. Ask questions and find answers about classic Apple desktops, laptops, accessories and peripherals.