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#1 2017-05-08 07:51:00

jeb0007
Member
Registered: 2017-05-08
Posts: 8

MAC PPC Tower type box G4 - SCSI Problem after shutdown

I think I posted this in the wrong forum area to start with so apologies. I don't know how to delete the other entry
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Hello... Please bear in mind I am a Windows user but help out in a small Hobbyist studio with MAC equipment- One of the Mac's is a G4 which was bought from new many years ago and has worked faultlessly.

There is much old archive media on this Mac which was complied with Media100 and we decided it was time to get all the media off and transfer it to the newer Mac's.

Whilst checking in Media100 edit suite for the various video media the MAC just shut down ( not crashing but as if the power was just removed ).. It had never ever done this before.

Pushed the On button and it started up but after a minute it shut down again ( just as if the button had been pushed to turn it off ).
Tried again and it started up and continued to run but then we noticed that the two internal SCSI Hdds were missing from the desktop icon position.

The Main Hdd was showing and also three firewire off board drives were showing.

Opening Media100 and loading a project showed the SCSI drives (NOT in a RAID configuration) could not be found.

Opening the case I removed the two SCSI drives and powered them up from a separate supply and they both spin up.

I removed the SCSI card ( ATTO ExpressPCI UL3D ) and powered up the Mac. I looked in the About Mac and looked for the devices connected and obviously the SCSI did not appear.

I re-fitted the SCSI card but did not connect the drives and powered up and the in the devices connect it did not show the SCSI card.

I then connect one of the drives and did the same routine and SCSI did not show up. I then disconnect that drive and connect the other drive, etc and that did not show up.

I connected both drives and they both appear in the Devises Connected. ? but they cannot be accessed.



Any guidance would be appreciated




20170505_122959.jpg

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#2 2017-05-08 17:44:27

macdrone
Member
From: Rainier, Or
Registered: 2014-05-25
Posts: 227

Re: MAC PPC Tower type box G4 - SCSI Problem after shutdown

The drives may have died/locked up/ stuck.  The motherboard battery is most likely dead so PRAM is causing issues also (par is like cmos).  how ever it was set up scsi devices have termination setups and device ID's.  So if you started switching stuff around you may have to find out how to undo anything you changed around.

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#3 2017-05-09 14:23:48

jeb0007
Member
Registered: 2017-05-08
Posts: 8

Re: MAC PPC Tower type box G4 - SCSI Problem after shutdown

Hello.. The system had been running for about half an hour that day when it shut down. The battery was changed about 6 months ago,,,The drives I removed and tested to see if they spin up were put back in the same order. The system runs fine at the moment and I have left it running for about 2 hours with no problems...apart from the SCSIs showing in devices connected but cannot get any access to them   sad

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#4 2017-05-10 02:17:22

macdrone
Member
From: Rainier, Or
Registered: 2014-05-25
Posts: 227

Re: MAC PPC Tower type box G4 - SCSI Problem after shutdown

scsi drives are notorious for failing.  Im glad you have a good battery, pram can still be corrupt, its why we have a pram startup reset key combo on boot.  Usually when a drive can be seen and is identified but cannot be accessed its a drive failure.  The fact it was "just working" does not mean anything.  I have a full garage full of macs and 4 stacks of scsi drives that were working when pulled, guess what, half of them when put back into a system dont work.  Its sometimes caps, heads stuck or any number of reasons that someone else can get to you.  Could always try one drive at a time setting the scsi ID to something else and terminate it.  A external enclosure is good if you can get one.

I have one enclosure I keep the  top off of just to test drives before install into a machine.  Bad noise(not normal scsi noises of course) or heat and I usually will just leave them out, just in case.

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#5 2017-05-10 07:27:32

jeb0007
Member
Registered: 2017-05-08
Posts: 8

Re: MAC PPC Tower type box G4 - SCSI Problem after shutdown

Thanks for the Info..  It is possible that BOTH drives failed at the same time?.  The SCSI card has 2 ports and I have tried the second port but the System crashed at start-up. I assume a utility is required to sort that?  I have tried one drive at a time but then it does not show in the Devices connected tree!!   Is there something else I need to do when I disconnect one of the drives and leave the other connected ( they are not configured as RAID).  The SCSI ribbon does have a terminator at the end. There are three connections on the ribbon. Two for the HDDs and the last for the terminator.
Thanks again for your guidance

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#6 2017-05-10 14:00:36

MacOS Plus
Member
Registered: 2015-12-09
Posts: 100

Re: MAC PPC Tower type box G4 - SCSI Problem after shutdown

Given the symptoms you described I'd be more inclined to suspect the SCSI card itself has failed.  That would be difficult to prove without another card to test with or another system to put it into, but it seems the most likely fault.  I would avoid continued testing with the drives attached if you value the contents of the drives because there's a good chance you'll cause corruption or even physical logic damage.  The SCSI card seems to be the common element in all of your testing and shouldn't be behaving the way it is if nothing else changed in your setup and it was working in that system in the past.

  I've had SCSI cards fail before and I also recently had a defective power supply in an external enclosure fry the controller board on a drive.  Some of my working cards don't get along with certain motherboards also.

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#7 2017-05-10 16:21:49

jeb0007
Member
Registered: 2017-05-08
Posts: 8

Re: MAC PPC Tower type box G4 - SCSI Problem after shutdown

All noted.....I will remove the SCSI card just in case it causes any other issues and try a replacement of some kind.  Thanks again..  Much appreciated...

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#8 2017-05-28 07:19:30

jeb0007
Member
Registered: 2017-05-08
Posts: 8

Re: MAC PPC Tower type box G4 - SCSI Problem after shutdown

Hello.. Well I got another SCSI card of the exact same type and the results are just the same. In the System Profile tree it shows the SCSI and the 2 HDD. If I unplug the ribbon from the card it does not show any SCSI in the system profile tree..  Any other ideas?

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#9 2017-06-02 07:35:46

jeb0007
Member
Registered: 2017-05-08
Posts: 8

Re: MAC PPC Tower type box G4 - SCSI Problem after shutdown

Would appreciate other tests?

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#10 2017-06-19 08:16:07

jeb0007
Member
Registered: 2017-05-08
Posts: 8

Re: MAC PPC Tower type box G4 - SCSI Problem after shutdown

Guess this is more difficult that first thought

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